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[EX_stream_tuna]

My answer to the camber question would be.....  depends on the drivetrain.

I'll do some crazy shit with FF and 4WD to get them to rotate better.  Crazy toe settings on those drivetrains as well.

There you go  This has been my experience too.  With FF cars you can do a "pivot" trick to make the rears help turn, and in such a ccase you do not want much camber, if any, up front and lots in the rear.  Gassing in parts of a turn where you'd usually be off-throttle or partial throttle, is how you make use of it once figured...

Credit for this trick is not mine, of course.  I learnt it from Dan_zitions / Doc_Savage_NDMF

The basics:
Lower camber front
Higher Camber rear
neg toe rear (where + is default)
Higher rear
Lower front
Softer rear
Stiffer front

[EX_stream_tuna]

Apparently you can change your tires to racing softs for the Vettel Standard challenge.

cool.  although, grip isn't the problem.  It's that those dumb AI keep going through the best driving lines at an extremely SLOW speed.

I tried to gold that whole championsihp a few times last night, and when the AI wasn't gettiing in the way I was in the lead on lap one or two.  Then, you'd have a race or two where you're driving fine, but then the AI slams on the brakes and you can't avoid hitting them and then spinning.  A spin at silverstone into the sand is VERY time expensive

WOW, what sounds this redbull has!!! (hopefully another hint as to what they might do for most cars in the future)

I really liked the Corvette concept and the seasonal for that, though.  (Currently fastest on FL if any of you want to go on the attack - no SRF)

[DudeTuna]

I think one of my favorite aspects of this game is that it was someone's job to sit there and manually enter stereotypical last names for a big list of countries that would be given a random first letter and become the AI opponents in Aspec.

Like some guy was at a desk with a piece of paper that said "Mexico" at the top and he had to come up with 20 last names...

"Uhh... Hernandez. Uh, Rodriguez and erm, Fernandez..." and on and on across the globe.

I want that gig.

Or you just open the phonebook.

[GoesTuna11]

My answer to the camber question would be.....  depends on the drivetrain.

I'll do some crazy shit with FF and 4WD to get them to rotate better.  Crazy toe settings on those drivetrains as well.

There you go  This has been my experience too.  With FF cars you can do a "pivot" trick to make the rears help turn, and in such a ccase you do not want much camber, if any, up front and lots in the rear.  Gassing in parts of a turn where you'd usually be off-throttle or partial throttle, is how you make use of it once figured...

Credit for this trick is not mine, of course.  I learnt it from Dan_zitions / Doc_Savage_NDMF

The basics:
Lower camber front
Higher Camber rear
neg toe rear (where + is default)
Higher rear
Lower front
Softer rear
Stiffer front

Sounds like gaming the system to me.

[EX_stream_tuna]

My answer to the camber question would be.....  depends on the drivetrain.

I'll do some crazy shit with FF and 4WD to get them to rotate better.  Crazy toe settings on those drivetrains as well.

There you go  This has been my experience too.  With FF cars you can do a "pivot" trick to make the rears help turn, and in such a ccase you do not want much camber, if any, up front and lots in the rear.  Gassing in parts of a turn where you'd usually be off-throttle or partial throttle, is how you make use of it once figured...

Credit for this trick is not mine, of course.  I learnt it from Dan_zitions / Doc_Savage_NDMF

The basics:
Lower camber front
Higher Camber rear
neg toe rear (where + is default)
Higher rear
Lower front
Softer rear
Stiffer front

Sounds like gaming the system to me.

Isn't that what tuning is, "gaming" the system of the last of physics?  This is something that works IRL too, it's just impractical in some applications (probably some weird tire wear) and unconventional.  The idea being that the front is doing all the work in an FF car.  It's better to make the toe and camber of the rears do some of the turning, like if you were driving a Forklift and the rears do the steering.

I wouldn't call it "gaming" as in some sort of exploit.  It's just making your car drive mroe liek a forklift.  Nuttin' wrong wit dat

[GoesTuna11]

My answer to the camber question would be.....  depends on the drivetrain.

I'll do some crazy shit with FF and 4WD to get them to rotate better.  Crazy toe settings on those drivetrains as well.

There you go  This has been my experience too.  With FF cars you can do a "pivot" trick to make the rears help turn, and in such a ccase you do not want much camber, if any, up front and lots in the rear.  Gassing in parts of a turn where you'd usually be off-throttle or partial throttle, is how you make use of it once figured...

Credit for this trick is not mine, of course.  I learnt it from Dan_zitions / Doc_Savage_NDMF

The basics:
Lower camber front
Higher Camber rear
neg toe rear (where + is default)
Higher rear
Lower front
Softer rear
Stiffer front

Sounds like gaming the system to me.

Isn't that what tuning is, "gaming" the system of the last of physics?  This is something that works IRL too, it's just impractical in some applications (probably some weird tire wear) and unconventional.  The idea being that the front is doing all the work in an FF car.  It's better to make the toe and camber of the rears do some of the turning, like if you were driving a Forklift and the rears do the steering.

I wouldn't call it "gaming" as in some sort of exploit.  It's just making your car drive mroe liek a forklift.  Nuttin' wrong wit dat

If it works in game, use it.  No problem with that.  But it detracts from the game when extreme settings that would never be used in real life, are advantageous in the game.  Front tires on a FF car will have less camber because they need to be flatter for straight line acceleration in addition to braking but I doubt that extreme toe and camber would be advantageous in real life.  Extreme toe out on the rears would likely scrub speed, increase tire wear and make the car unstable.

[dlrws6]

Regarding Camber  and FF cars depending on how you described extreme it is done in real life.  It is hard to see but check out this video of the BTCC series back in 1999.  All FF cars and most with the rear wheels with enough camber to make them visually appear to stick out from the cars body work, compared to the front.


Keep in mind on an FF car the back wheels are just essentially along for the ride and do not wear nearly as quick as the fronts which do the majority of the work. So on a twisty track why not spread the rear wheels and to loosen the back end of the car up to aid it corner rotation?


Personally on an FF car in game I run about 2.0 camber on the rear wheels with around .5, or less, on the front and as little LSD as possible.


BTCC 1999 Round 1 - Donington Park

[dlrws6]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops.    Here are my current test numbers.  Keep in mind all testing was done on Apricot Hill with Racing hard tires.

FF
07 VW Scirosucco two 10 lap stints v1.03
Stint one 5, 3 front 8, 7 rear
Stint two 4, 1* front 9, 7 rear

*I don’t know if tires go to 0.  This one felt flat as soon as it hit 1 halfway through the last lap.

I have not reviewed lap times yet.

4WD

Subaru S206 NBR Challenge something: two 10 lap stints v1.04
Stint One 6, 3 front 8, 7 rear, best lap 1:31.656*
Stint Two 5, 3 front 8, 6 rear, best lap 1:30.741

*I figured this was a fluke just one to many mistakes. I restarted and did another five laps on the first set of tires and ran a 1:30.900.  I plan to run this one again. But the car felt like it had more grip and generally faster on the second stint.

On a side note this car is an awesome car to drive and I hate 4WD cars.

FR

00’ Camaro SS two 10 lap stints v1.04
Stint One 5, 2 front 8, 7 rear best lap 1:32.430
Stint Two 5, 3 front 6, 5 rear best lap 1:32.740

Finally as a consistency test and a quick comparison of the game versions  I ran several 8 lap races with the same Camaro. Here are the results tire wear only.

Race 1. V 1.03
S1 8,6 front 9, 9 rear
S2 8,7 front 8,8 rear
Race 2.
S1 8,8 front 9,9 rear
S2 8,7 front 9,8 rear
Race 3:
S1 8,7 front 9,9 rear
S2 8,8 front 9,8 rear
Race 4 V1.04
S1 8,8 front 9,9 rear
S2 8,8 front 9,8 rear
Race 5
S1 8,6 front 9,9 rear (I made a few mistakes this stint)
S2 8,7 front 9,8 rear

Its harder to see with the shorter lap count but the rear tires consistently wore quicker on the second stint compaired to the first, without a similar increase in the fronts.

[GoesTuna11]

Regarding Camber  and FF cars depending on how you described extreme it is done in real life.  It is hard to see but check out this video of the BTCC series back in 1999.  All FF cars and most with the rear wheels with enough camber to make them visually appear to stick out from the cars body work, compared to the front.


Keep in mind on an FF car the back wheels are just essentially along for the ride and do not wear nearly as quick as the fronts which do the majority of the work. So on a twisty track why not spread the rear wheels and to loosen the back end of the car up to aid it corner rotation?


Personally on an FF car in game I run about 2.0 camber on the rear wheels with around .5, or less, on the front and as little LSD as possible.

As I said and others as well, rear camber on an FF car can be higher because they can be optimized for turning.  The rear tires aren't as important for braking and have no power going towards them so straight line contact is not as important.

[RickS95]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops.    Here are my current test numbers.  Keep in mind all testing was done on Apricot Hill with Racing hard tires.

FF
07 VW Scirosucco two 10 lap stints v1.03
Stint one 5, 3 front 8, 7 rear
Stint two 4, 1* front 9, 7 rear

*I don’t know if tires go to 0.  This one felt flat as soon as it hit 1 halfway through the last lap.

Yes, tires can go down to 0.  I did it the other day at Silverstone and I'll be damned if I didn't hear what sounded like a pop when it went from 1 to 0.

[EX_stream_tuna]

My answer to the camber question would be.....  depends on the drivetrain.

I'll do some crazy shit with FF and 4WD to get them to rotate better.  Crazy toe settings on those drivetrains as well.

There you go  This has been my experience too.  With FF cars you can do a "pivot" trick to make the rears help turn, and in such a ccase you do not want much camber, if any, up front and lots in the rear.  Gassing in parts of a turn where you'd usually be off-throttle or partial throttle, is how you make use of it once figured...

Credit for this trick is not mine, of course.  I learnt it from Dan_zitions / Doc_Savage_NDMF

The basics:
Lower camber front
Higher Camber rear
neg toe rear (where + is default)
Higher rear
Lower front
Softer rear
Stiffer front

Sounds like gaming the system to me.

Isn't that what tuning is, "gaming" the system of the last of physics?  This is something that works IRL too, it's just impractical in some applications (probably some weird tire wear) and unconventional.  The idea being that the front is doing all the work in an FF car.  It's better to make the toe and camber of the rears do some of the turning, like if you were driving a Forklift and the rears do the steering.

I wouldn't call it "gaming" as in some sort of exploit.  It's just making your car drive mroe liek a forklift.  Nuttin' wrong wit dat

If it works in game, use it.  No problem with that.  But it detracts from the game when extreme settings that would never be used in real life, are advantageous in the game.  Front tires on a FF car will have less camber because they need to be flatter for straight line acceleration in addition to braking but I doubt that extreme toe and camber would be advantageous in real life.  Extreme toe out on the rears would likely scrub speed, increase tire wear and make the car unstable.

IDK if the numbers I'd typicaly plug into an FF car using the scheme above would be considered extreme, just unconventional. I don't put tons of toe on either end.  I guess it would depend on track, though.

I agreed with what dlrws6 was saying bout it too...

[DudeTuna]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops.    Here are my current test numbers.  Keep in mind all testing was done on Apricot Hill with Racing hard tires.

FF
07 VW Scirosucco two 10 lap stints v1.03
Stint one 5, 3 front 8, 7 rear
Stint two 4, 1* front 9, 7 rear

*I don’t know if tires go to 0.  This one felt flat as soon as it hit 1 halfway through the last lap.

Yes, tires can go down to 0.  I did it the other day at Silverstone and I'll be damned if I didn't hear what sounded like a pop when it went from 1 to 0.

All I know is when my rear tires hit "1" I could no longer control the car. The fact you kept doing donuts until they popped and went to 0 is too funny. 

[ChromeTuna]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops. 

I'm in the process of retesting the same cars I ran with 1.03. I had read at GTP that AWD cars were handling different, and upon hard accel, were lighting up the rears as if only being rear drive. I found this to be the case on my 2012 GTR Black Edition. It was not like this before update 1.04, but it's still very controllable. More on that later.

dlr, once I get the other two cars retested, I'll make a thread, and copy your post over there as well. I'd like to revisit this test after every update, just to see what changes.

[RickS95]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops.    Here are my current test numbers.  Keep in mind all testing was done on Apricot Hill with Racing hard tires.

FF
07 VW Scirosucco two 10 lap stints v1.03
Stint one 5, 3 front 8, 7 rear
Stint two 4, 1* front 9, 7 rear

*I don’t know if tires go to 0.  This one felt flat as soon as it hit 1 halfway through the last lap.

Yes, tires can go down to 0.  I did it the other day at Silverstone and I'll be damned if I didn't hear what sounded like a pop when it went from 1 to 0.

All I know is when my rear tires hit "1" I could no longer control the car. The fact you kept doing donuts until they popped and went to 0 is too funny. 

I had been driving for roughly 20 minutes and wanted whatever purse they'd give me.

[DudeTuna]

But on to the business at hand.  Regarding tire wear and pit stops.    Here are my current test numbers.  Keep in mind all testing was done on Apricot Hill with Racing hard tires.

FF
07 VW Scirosucco two 10 lap stints v1.03
Stint one 5, 3 front 8, 7 rear
Stint two 4, 1* front 9, 7 rear

*I don’t know if tires go to 0.  This one felt flat as soon as it hit 1 halfway through the last lap.

Yes, tires can go down to 0.  I did it the other day at Silverstone and I'll be damned if I didn't hear what sounded like a pop when it went from 1 to 0.

All I know is when my rear tires hit "1" I could no longer control the car. The fact you kept doing donuts until they popped and went to 0 is too funny. 

I had been driving for roughly 20 minutes and wanted whatever purse they'd give me.

I spun out at Suzuka just after the first time split on the 10th lap. I partly made it up the esses, but not quite to the top of the hill. Then nada.